Try โ€‚โ€‰HackMD

SEIZE is a Korean science YouTuber. English translation first and then Korean transcript. Transcription by Seo Sanghyeon and translation by Kang Seonghoon.

Added on 2023-08-06: We have been pointed out that Hyun-Tak Kim's use of words superconductor ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ฒด and superconductivity ์ดˆ์ „๋„ is very consistent. So to make it easy to see, we updated the translation and transcript to highlight them.

English translation

[This translation has been slightly paraphrased for the purpose of translation. Any significant additions and notes are indicated like this.]

LK-99, it has been controversial if it was indeed a superconductor or not. SEIZE contacted an author of this paper and he said:

Hyun-Tak Kim (HTK): There is no way, superconductivity is the only possible explanation.

In today's New Material [Ed: programme name ์‹ ๋ฌธ๋ฌผ, lit. New Culture] we discuss LK-99.

Q: Why didn't you publish a proper paper on this important research?

HTK: I would originally publish a paper to the academic journal, go through the review process and would post the [preprint] right before that, but in this case we had some reason to hurry up. So we posted the paper to both the journal and to [arXiv] simultaneously. We had no other choice.

Q: There are two same papers posted to arXiv, why?

HTK: One of them has not been approved by authors, one had. The paper with more authors [Ed: arXiv 2307.12037] did receive approvals from all authors and went through the normal process, while one with less authors [Ed: arXiv 2307.12008] didn't go through such process and would be considered unjust [Ed: possibly interpreted as academic dishonesty but also just mere disapproval].

Q: The Korean Society of Superconductivity and Cyrogenics (KSSC) requested a sample for the verification.

HTK: They indeed requested a sample, our research team agreed to help the research with Korean physicists. But verification thereafter? That's another matter.

Q: There had been a criticism that the zero resistance was never demonstrated.

HTK: In the metal, discontinuity towards a lower resistance is said to be a [significance] of superconductivity. We think it is clear without an additional measurement, because whether the resistance is zero or notโ€“-the zero resistance would look like a noise. The research team has published a Korean paper [Ed: DOI 10.6111/JKCGCT.2023.33.2.061], which was the first ever publication and shown a graph with that kind of noise. You are supposed to look at that paper. There was a controversy on whether the superconductivity indeed exhibits the zero resistance a century ago, which has been a continuing point of tension since the discovery of superconductivity. But [we've already shown] the jump and zero resistance via actual measurements in the first paper [Ed: in Korean], so we didn't feel to include them in the second paper [Ed: the first one in arXiv]. There has been enormous requests for samples all around the world, and we have no time to spare, let alone showing what we already know again.

Q: Why did LK-99 in the released video partially float?

HTK: [The Meissner effect is supposed to be] completely floating, not partially. Let's talk about one dimension; you can draw a single line to a plane, likewise if we have one-dimensional metal, then neighboring [materials] would be non-metal. The measurement would measure both and we were yet to produce a very homogeneous sample, which is a reason for the slanted look I believe. The further technological development would allow an increased angle of slant, but it would never float perfectly like today's two-dimensional and three-dimensional superconductors. We are still able to cut and take the one dimensional section and make [things] out of it, which needs a further technological development. This is only the starting point, isn't it?

Q: How did you join this effort?

HTK: My theoretical paper was published in 2021, and Q-Centre told me that they seem to have produced superconductivity. Professor Keun Ho Auh saw my paper and, as they thought they were lacking in the theoretical manner and as the author in question was Korean, called ETRI [Ed: HTK's then-employer] to contact me.

Q: How would you tell if something is a superconductor or not?

HTK: The first criterion for superconductivity is a jump due to the transition from gap to no gap; the state with energy gap and one without it has a discontinuous jump between them. So whether something is superconductivity or notโ€“-okay, in metal, the superconductivity is a jump towards lower resistance.

Q: There is a criticism that it is an MIT (metal-insulator transition) material, not a superconductor.

HTK: If the jump is towards higher resistance it would be indeed metal-insulator transition, i.e. transition to insulator. On the other hand transition to metal is superconductivity.

[Caption:] The explanation of the interview would be uploaded next week.

Korean transcript

[This is a faithful transcription as much as possible. Hence sometimes grammar is wrong and words are in dialect. It does not match YouTube's Korean transcript, both automatic and manual one by the channel.]

LK-99! ์ด๊ฒŒ ์ง„์งœ ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ฒด๋ƒ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ƒ ๋– ๋“ค์ฉํ•œ๋ฐ, SEIZE๊ฐ€ ์ด ์˜์ƒ์„ ์˜ฌ๋ฆฐ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ ์ €์ž๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋‚ฌ๋”๋‹ˆ ์ €์ž๋Š” ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋งํ–ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค

๊น€ํ˜„ํƒ: ๋ฐฉ๋ฒ•์ด ์—†์ž–์•„์š” ์ดˆ์ „๋„ ์™ธ์—๋Š” ์„ค๋ช…ํ•  ๋ฐฉ๋ฒ•์ด ์—†์–ด์š”

์˜ค๋Š˜์˜ ์‹ ๋ฌธ๋ฌผ LK-99์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค

Q: ์™œ ์ค‘์š”ํ•œ ์—ฐ๊ตฌ๋ฅผ ์ •์‹ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์œผ๋กœ ๋จผ์ € ์•ˆ ๋ƒˆ๋‚˜? [์ดํ•˜ ์งˆ๋ฌธ์€ ๋ชจ๋‘ ์ž๋ง‰]

๊น€: ์›๋ž˜๋Š” ์ œ ์Šคํƒ€์ผ์€ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์„ ์ €๋„์— ๋‚ด๊ณ  ๊ทธ ์ธ์ž ๋ฆฌ๋ทฐ ๊ณผ์ •์„ ๋‹ค ๋๋‚˜๊ณ  ๋‚˜๋Š” ๊ทธ ์ง์ „์— ์ด๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ์˜ฌ๋ฆฌ๋Š”๋ฐ ์ข€ ๊ฑฐ๊ธฐ์—๋Š” ์กฐ๊ธˆ ๋ฌด์Šจ ์‚ฌ์—ฐ์ด ์žˆ์–ด์š” ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ด๊ฒŒ ๊ธ‰ํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋‚ด์ง€ ์•Š์œผ๋ฉด ์•ˆ ๋˜๋Š” ์‚ฌ์—ฐ์ด ์ข€ ์ƒ๊ฒจ๊ฐ€์ง€๊ณ  ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์„ ์ €๋„์— ๋‚ด๋ฉด์„œ ๋™์‹œ์— ๊ทธ๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ๋ƒˆ์–ด์š” ๋ถˆ๊ฐ€ํ”ผํ•œ ์ƒํ™ฉ์ด ์ƒ๊ฒจ๊ฐ€์ง€๊ณ  ๊ทธ๋ ‡๊ฒŒ ํ–ˆ์–ด์š”

Q: ์•„์นด์ด๋ธŒ์— ๊ฐ™์€ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์ด 2๊ฐœ๊ฐ€ ์˜ฌ๋ผ์™”๋˜๋ฐ?

๊น€: ๊ทธ ์ €์ž ๋™์˜๊ฐ€ ํ•˜๋‚˜๋Š” ์•ˆ ๋ฐ›์€ ๊ฑฐ๊ณ ์š” ํ•˜๋‚˜๋Š” ์ €์ž ๋™์˜๋ฅผ ๋ฐ›์€ ๊ฑฐ์—์š” ์ €์ž๊ฐ€ ๋งˆ์ด ์žˆ๋Š” ๊ฑฐ๋Š” ๋ชจ๋“  ์ €์ž๊ฐ€ ๋™์˜๋ฅผ ํ•ด์„œ ์ •์ƒ ์ ˆ์ฐจ๋Œ€๋กœ ๊ฐ„ ๊ฑฐ๊ณ  ๋‚˜๋จธ์ง€๋Š” ๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ ์ ˆ์ฐจ๋ฅผ ๋ชป ๋ฐŸ์•˜๊ธฐ ๋•Œ๋ฌธ์— ๋ถ€์ •์ด ๋˜๋Š” ๊ฑฐ

Q: ํ•œ๊ตญ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ €์˜จํ•™ํšŒ๊ฐ€ ๊ฒ€์ฆ์„ ์œ„ํ•ด ์ƒ˜ํ”Œ์„ ์š”๊ตฌํ–ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ?

๊น€: ๊ทธ๊ฒŒ ์ธ์ž ์ƒ˜ํ”Œ์„ ์ธ์ž ์ง€๊ธˆ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ ์ด์ชฝ์— ๊ทธ ์—ฐ๊ตฌํŒ€ํ•˜๊ณ  ์Œ ํ•œ๊ตญ ๋ฌผ๋ฆฌํ•™์ž๋“ค์ด ์—ฐ๊ตฌํ•˜๋Š”๋ฐ ๋„์›€์„ ์ฃผ๊ธฐ๋กœ ํ•˜๋Š”๋ฐ ๋™์˜ํ–ˆ๊ณ ์š” ๊ทธ๋‹ค์Œ์— ๊ฒ€์ฆ์„ ํ•œ๋‹ค? ์ด ๋ฌธ์ œ๋Š” ๋˜ ๋‹ค๋ฅธ ๋ฌธ์ œ์—์š”

Q: ์ €ํ•ญ์ด ์™œ 0์ด ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ƒ๋Š” ๋ฐ˜๋ฐ•๋„ ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ

๊น€: ๊ธˆ์†์—์„œ ์ €ํ•ญ์ด ๋‚ฎ์€ ์ชฝ์œผ๋กœ ๋ถˆ์—ฐ์†์ด ๋š ๋–จ์–ด์ ธ ๋ฒ„๋ฆฌ๋ฉด ๊ทธ๊ฑฐ ์ดˆ์ „๋„๋ผ ๊ทธ๋žฌ์ฃ ? ๊ทธ๊ฑฐ๋Š” ์žฌ ๋ณด๋‚˜๋งˆ๋‚˜ ๋งž๋‹ค ์™œ๋ƒ๋ฉด ์ €ํ•ญ์ด 0์ด๋ƒ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ƒ ์ด๊ฑฐ๋Š” ์ €ํ•ญ์ด 0์ด๋ฉด ๋…ธ์ด์ฆˆ ๊ฐ™์•„์š” ์‹คํ—˜์€ ์ด๋ฏธ ๋…ธ์ด์ฆˆ๊ฐ€ ๋‚˜์˜ค๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์€ ์ด ์—ฐ๊ตฌํŒ€์ด ํ•œ๊ธ€ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์„ ๋ฐœํ‘œํ–ˆ์–ด์š” ํ•œ๊ธ€ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์ด ์ตœ์ดˆ ๋ฐœํ‘œ์—์š” ํ•œ๊ธ€ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ ์†์— ๊ทธ ๋…ธ์ด์ฆˆ ํƒ€๋Š” ๋ฐ์ดํ„ฐ๊ฐ€ ์‹ค๋ ค ์žˆ์–ด์š” ๊ทธ๋Ÿผ ๊ทธ๊ฑฐ ๋ด๋ผ ์ด๊ฑฐ์ง€ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๊ฐ€ ์ €ํ•ญ์ด ์ดˆ์ „๋„ ์ƒํƒœ์˜ ์ €ํ•ญ์ด 0์ด ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ƒ๋Š” 100๋…„ ์ „์— ๋…ผ์Ÿ์ด ์žˆ์—ˆ์–ด์š” ์ด ์ดˆ์ „๋„ ํ˜„์ƒ์ด ๊ด€์ธก์ด ๋˜๋ฉด์„œ ํ•ญ์ƒ ๋’ค์— ๋”ฐ๋ผ๋‹ค๋‹ˆ๋Š” ๊ฑด๋ฐ ์ด๋ฏธ ์ ํ”„๊ฐ€ ๋‚˜์™”๊ณ  ์ด๋Ÿฌ๋ฉด ๋‹น์—ฐํžˆ ๊ทธ๋Ÿฐ๋ฐ ๋˜ ์‹ค์ œ ์žฌ ๋ณด๋‹ˆ๊นŒ 0์ด ๋‚˜์™”๋‹ค ์Œ ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ๊ทธ๊ฑฐ๋Š” ์ฒซ๋ฒˆ์งธ ๊ทธ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์— ๋‚˜์™”์œผ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๊ฐ€ ๋‘๋ฒˆ์งธ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์—” ํ•„์š” ์—†์ž–์•„ ์ „ ์„ธ๊ณ„์—์„œ ์ƒ˜ํ”Œ ๋‹ฌ๋ผ๊ณ ๋„ ์–ด๋งˆ์–ด๋งˆํ•˜๊ฒŒ ์˜ค๊ณ  ๊ทธ๋žฌ๋Š”๋ฐ ๊ทธ ์‹œ๊ฐ„์„ ๋‚ญ๋น„ํ•  ๊ฒจ๋ฅผ์ด ์—†์ง€ ์•Š๋Š๋ƒ ์ด๊ฑฐ์ฃ  ์ด๋ฏธ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋Š” ์•„๋Š”๋ฐ

Q: ์˜์ƒ์—์„œ LK-99๊ฐ€ ์™„์ „ํžˆ ๋œจ์ง€ ์•Š๋Š” ์ด์œ ๋Š”?

๊น€: ๋‹ค ๋– ์•ผ ๋˜๋Š”๋ฐ ์™„์ „ํžˆ ๋ชป ๋–ด๋‹จ ๋ง์ด์•ผ 1์ฐจ์›์ด๋ผ๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์ด ๋ญ๋‚˜๋ฉด ์ด ํ‰๋ฉด์ด 1์ฐจ์›์„ ๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๋ฉด ํ•œ ๊ฐœ์˜ ์„ ์„ ๊ทธ๋ฆฌ๊ฒŒ ๋˜์ž–์•„์š” 1์ฐจ์›์ด ๊ธˆ์†์ด ๋˜๋ฉด ์˜†์— ์žˆ๋Š”๊ฑด ๋ญ์—์š”? ๋…ผ๋ฉ”ํƒˆ์ด ๋˜๋Š” ๊ฑฐ์ง€ ์ธก์ •์„ ํ•˜๋ฉด ๋‘ ๊ฐœ๊ฐ€ ๊ฐ™์ด ๋‚˜ํƒ€๋‚˜๊ฒŒ ๋˜๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ์•„์ฃผ ํ˜ธ๋ชจ์ €๋„ˆ์Šคํ•œ ์ƒ˜ํ”Œ์€ ๋ชป ๋งŒ๋“  ๊ฑฐ์—์š” ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ด๊ฒŒ ์‚๋”ฑํ•˜๊ฒŒ ์„ฐ์ง€ ์•Š๋Š๋ƒ๋Š” ์ด๋ž˜ ๋ณด๋Š” ๊ฑฐ์—์š” ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์•ž์œผ๋กœ๋„ ๊ธฐ์ˆ  ๊ฐœ๋ฐœ์„ ํ•˜๋ฉด ์ชผ๋” ๋” ๋„์šธ ์ˆ˜๋Š” ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ ์•„์ฃผ ์ง€๊ธˆ 2์ฐจ์› 3์ฐจ์› ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ฒด๋งŒํผ ์ข‹์•„์ง€์ง€๋Š” ์•Š๋Š”๋‹ค ๊ทผ๋ฐ ์š”๊ฑฐ๋ฅผ ๊ธฐ์ˆ ์ ์œผ๋กœ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ 1์ฐจ์› ๋ผ์ธ์„ ์‹น ๊นŽ์•„ ์˜ค๋ ค๋‚ผ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๊ฒ ์ง€? ๊ณ ๊ฑธ ๊ฐ–๊ณ  ๋งŒ๋“ค๋ฉด ์ด์ œ ๊ณ ๋Ÿฐ ๊ฑฐ๋Š” ๊ธฐ์ˆ  ๊ฐœ๋ฐœ์ด ์•ž์œผ๋กœ ํ•„์š”ํ•œ ๋ถ€๋ถ„ ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ด์ชฝ์œผ๋กœ ๊ธฐ์ˆ  ๊ฐœ๋ฐœ์„ ๋งˆ์ด ํ•ด์•ผ ๋ผ ์ธ์ œ ๊ฒŒ์šฐ ์‹œ์ž‘์ด์ž–์•„ ๊ทธ์ฃ ?

Q: ์ด๋ฒˆ ์—ฐ๊ตฌ์— ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ์ฐธ์—ฌํ•˜๊ฒŒ ๋๋‚˜?

๊น€: ์ œ ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์ด ๋‚˜์™”์„ ๋•Œ 2021๋…„๋ˆ๋ฐ์š” ๊ทธ๋•Œ ์ž๊ธฐ๋“ค์ด ์ดˆ์ „๋„๋ฅผ ๋งŒ๋“  ๊ฒƒ ๊ฐ™๋Œ€ ๋งŒ๋“ค์—ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ ์˜ค๊ทผํ˜ธ ๊ต์ˆ˜๋‹˜์ด ๋‚ด ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์„ ๋ณด์…จ์–ด ๋ณด์‹œ๊ณ  ์ž๊ธฐ๋“ค์€ ์•„๋ฌด๋ฆฌ ๊ทธ๋ž˜๋„ ์ด๋ก  ๋ถ€๋ถ„์ด ๋”ธ๋ฆฌ์ž–์•„ ๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ํ•œ๊ตญ ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ์Šค๋งˆํŠธํฐ์œผ๋กœ ๋ง‰ ETRI ์ „ํ™” ๋ฌผ์–ด ๊ฐ€์ง€๊ณ  ์ „ํ™”ํ•œ๊ฑฐ์ง€

Q: ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ฒด์ธ์ง€ ์–ด๋–ป๊ฒŒ ์•Œ์•„๋ณผ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๋‚˜?

๊น€: ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ธ์ง€ ์•„๋‹Œ์ง€๋ฅผ ์•Œ์•„๋ณด๋Š” ์ฒซ ๋ณด๋Š” ์ˆœ๊ฐ„์ด ๋ญ๊ฒ ์–ด์š” ๊ฐญ-๋…ธ๊ฐญ ํŠธ๋žœ์ง€์…˜์˜ ํŠน์ง•์ด ๋ญ๋ƒ๋ฉด ์ ํ”„๊ฐ€ ์žˆ์–ด์š” ์ ํ”„ ๊ฐญ์„ ๊ฐ€์ง„ ์ƒํƒœ์™€ ์•„๋‹Œ ์ƒํƒœ ์‚ฌ์ด์—๋Š” ๋ถˆ์—ฐ์† ์ ํ”„๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋Š” ๊ฑฐ์—์š” ๊ทธ๋Ÿฌ๋‹ˆ๊นŒ ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ด๋ƒ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ƒ๋Š” ๊ธˆ์†์—์„œ ์ €ํ•ญ์ด ๋–จ์–ด์ง€๋Š” ์ชฝ์œผ๋กœ ๋ญ๋ƒ ์ € ์ ํ”„๊ฐ€ ์žˆ๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์€ ์ดˆ์ „๋„์—์š”

Q: ์ดˆ์ „๋„์ฒด๊ฐ€ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ MIT ๋ฌผ์งˆ์ด๋ž€ ๋ฐ˜๋ฐ•๋„ ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ

๊น€: ๊ธˆ์†์—์„œ ์ €ํ•ญ์ด ์ฆ๊ฐ€ํ•˜๋Š” ์ชฝ์œผ๋กœ ์žˆ๋Š” ์ ํ”„๋Š” ๊ทธ ๊ธˆ์† ์ ˆ์—ฐ์ฒด ์ „์ด ์ธ์Š๋ ˆ์ดํƒ€ ๋ฉ”ํƒˆ ํŠธ๋žœ์ง€์…˜ ๊ทธ์ชฝ์ด๊ณ ์š” ์ ˆ์—ฐ์ฒด๋กœ ๊ฑฐ ๋ญ๋ƒ ๊ฑฐ ์ € ํŠธ๋žœ์ง€์…˜์ด ์ƒ๊ธด ๊ฑฐ๊ณ  ๊ธˆ์†์œผ๋กœ ๊ฐ€๋Š” ๊ฒฝ์šฐ๋Š” ์ดˆ์ „๋„์—์š”

[์ž๋ง‰:] ์ธํ„ฐ๋ทฐ ํ•ด์„ค ์˜์ƒ์€ ๋‹ค์Œ์ฃผ ์—…๋กœ๋“œ ์˜ˆ์ •์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค