# 2020-08-05 conda-forge core meeting

###### tags: `meeting-notes`

****

[Zoom link](https://flatiron.zoom.us/j/93242638216?pwd=bjRCWmVJRW1oTGJhN09VUmxtTTJOUT09 )
[What time is the meeting in my time zone](https://arewemeetingyet.com/UTC/2020-08-05/17:00/w/Conda-forge%20dev%20meeting#eyJ1cmwiOiJodHRwczovL2hhY2ttZC5pby9wUk15dFVKV1FmU3NJM2xvMGlqQzJRP2VkaXQifQ==)

## Attendees
* Matthew R. Becker
* Cheng H. Lee
* CJ
* Ray Douglass
* Paul Martin
* Isuru
* Keith K
* Sylvain
* Wolf
* Michael Sarahan
* Scopatz
* Helmus
* Marcelo
* Marius van Niekerk

## Agenda

### Standing items
* [x] intros for new folks on the call
* [x] (CJ) budget

### Your new agenda items

* [x] (MRB) going to start removing people from feedstocks
* smithy and the web services have not been removing people from maintenance teams
when they are no longer listed in the recipe
* I put in a bug fix for this
* I tested the bug fix in various permutations using a test feedstock. Works fine.
* going to roll it out
* make an announcement
* turn it on for the webservices
* use an admin migration to clean up the rest of the feedstocks
* No issues or concerns raised

* [x] (MRB) finally finish CFEP-13
* the output validation appears to be working fine
* (IF) we still have git clone issues from time to time, but not a huge issue
* (MRB) The latest smithy fixes though so they should be less and less common as people
use the updated version.
* last step is to rotate the binstar token
* going to delete all current tokens for conda-forge and make a new one that
just lives in heroku and admin-requests
* roll out:
* make an announcement
* make a new token
* update heroku with new token
* update admin-requests with new token
* hopefully we don't break anything
* post roll out cleanup
* remove any old encrypted tokens from conda-forge.yml in feedstocks
* put staging token in the azure global cred we use
* remove individual creds from azure builds
* Consider dropping building python 3.6 with PGO (Windows builds on appveyor)

* [x] Dropping python 3.6
* need an announcement cycle
* should we follow NEP29? NEP29 + 6 months?
* https://numpy.org/neps/nep-0029-deprecation_policy.html#drop-schedule
* End of life for Python 3.x versions:
* https://devguide.python.org/#status-of-python-branches
* No pypy for 3.7
* https://foss.heptapod.net/pypy/pypy/-/wikis/py3.7%20status
* Action Item: Send to issue (get input from pypy team and others)

* [x] (CHL) Upcoming conda 4.8.4 release; planning for 4.9.0
* 4.8.4 is (more or less) bug fix only, including two bugs that cause data loss.
* Expected release date: 2020-08-07 (ish).
* 4.9.0 in planning:
* Should be relatively fast follow from 4.8.4 (1-2 months following)
* Major changes: Isuru's CPU feature flags and osx-arm64 PRs (changes
virtual package reporting; adds new un-tested, "un-released" platform
so not appropriate for patch release)
* (MRB) This one too please: https://github.com/conda/conda/pull/10057
* looks like it is on 4.9.0

* [x] (Paul Martin) Repacking intel MKL from intel instead of Anaconda
* https://github.com/conda-forge/intel_repack-feedstock/pulls
* https://github.com/conda-forge/intel_repack-feedstock/pull/12
* Action Items:
* Request input from Intel on their level of comforat among our options for repackaging
* If they are comfortable with a direct repackage ask for permissions to scrape the version
numbers as needed by the bot
* If Intel is comfortable with bot scraping, put up issue to cf-scripts to enable
* Check back in one month unless things happen sooner

### Stuff from last week that we didn't get to

### Active votes

### Subteam updates

#### Bot

#### ARM

#### POWER

#### CUDA

#### Docs

#### staged-recipes

#### website

#### security+systems

See items above.

### CI infrastructure

#### Compiler upgrade

### CFEP updates

#### Open PRs

* [cfep-04](https://github.com/conda-forge/conda-forge-enhancement-proposals/pull/7) X11 and CDT policy
* INACTIVE - Merge in with some inactive-esque status?
* Needs new champion. Thanks for your work on this pkgw! Has unaddressed comments from pkgw as from Jan 10, 2020

* [cfep-06](https://github.com/conda-forge/conda-forge-enhancement-proposals/pull/9) Staged-recipes review lifecycle
* INACTIVE - Merge in with some inactive-esque status?
* Lingering comment from @saraedum. @jakirkham, can you reply? Has unadressed comment from @saraedum from Jan 8, 2020
* (MRB) The stalebot has solved the worst of the issues here. I think we could defer this one permanently.

* [cfep-10](https://github.com/conda-forge/conda-forge-enhancement-proposals/pull/15) Feedstock statuses, unmaintained
* INACTIVE - Merge in with some inactive-esque status?
* Needs another review. Has unaddressed updates from pkgw as of Jan 11, 2020

* [cfep-12](https://github.com/conda-forge/cfep/pull/23) Removing packages that violate the terms of the source package
* Stalled since May 26, 2020
* Active debate about moving to "broken" vs deleting from conda-forge channel
* Active vote, ends on 2020-03-11
* What were the results of the vote?
* Did we hear back from NumFOCUS?

* [cfep-17](https://github.com/conda-forge/cfep/pull/32) Handling pin backports and dependency rebuilds
* Stalled debate about implementation details between Isuru, CJ and Matt
* **UPDATE 2020-07-22**: We in principle have agreement to render the extra pinnings needed directly in the feedstock
on a temporary basis (i.e., until the migration has ended).

## Discussion

## Check in on previous action items
Copy previous action items from last meeting agenda.

### This meeting

### Last meeting
* [ ] Figure out how to communicate breaking changes to users. Likely should open up an issue immediately for futher discussion. Ping @kkraus, plus capture notes from further up in these meeting notes
* [ ] (Eric) TODO: Make strict an option in conda_forge.yaml and turn it on by default. Open issue in conda-smithy

### 2 meetings ago
* [ ] Eric to add a new page to our docs around how to engage with conda-forge and affiliated in a commercial relationship.
* [ ] Eric will get the NVBug link from Keith and archive it in the conda-forge google drive.
* [ ] John K. will update the cuda toolkit feedstock on the git repo to note the NVBug link to the internal NVIDIA issue tracker
* [ ] Jonathan will update docs to note that some non-exhaustive list of packages (like cuda-toolkit, MKL, etc.)
* [ ] Jonathan will review this [PR](https://github.com/AnacondaRecipes/cudatoolkit-feedstock/pull/7)

### 3 meetings ago

### Move to Issue Tracker
* [ ] (Kale) schedule conda working group
* [ ] cfep-10 next steps: CJ to call a vote for feedback
* [ ] cfep-06 next steps: Ask staged recipes team to champion this CFEP and move it forward
* [ ] jakirkham & CJ-wright to sync on adding CUDA to the migration bot
* [ ] (Eric) Scheduling Anaconda <-> conda-forge sync on anaconda.org requirements gathering
* Will try and get this scheduled in the next month.
* [ ] (Anthony) Reach out to NumFocus to figure out legal ramifications of not including licenses in files.
* [ ] (Eric) check internally for funding levels for hotels & flying folks from the community in?
* [ ] (Eric) Figure out finances of conda-forge to support themselves?
* [ ] (jjhelmus) Open up CFEP for which python's we're going to support
* [ ] (jakirkham) write a blog post on CUDA stuff we discussed today
* [ ] (jakirkham) update docs on how to add CUDA support to feedstocks
* [ ] (jakirkham) will open an issue on conda-smithy to investigate Drone issues. (ping the aarch team)
* https://github.com/conda-forge/conda-forge.github.io/issues/954
* [ ] (ED) Who we are page? Some combination of a FAQ and a who is everyone. FAQ things like:
* who's the POC for CF <> Anaconda, CF <> NumFocus, CF <> Azure
* who's the POC for the various subteams?
* Informal information: roles, day jobs, bios, the whole nine yards, why you're here, etc.
* Public or internal? I don't really care either way. Anyone feel strongly one way or the other?
* opt-in to public bios
* software carpentry has a large number of instructors and has https://carpentries.org/instructors
* some concern about "yet another place to keep stuff up to date"
* [ ] (CJ) Form finance subteam
* [ ] (ED) document strategies for reproducible environments using conda-forge
* [ ] (UK) Static libraries stuff
* [ ] Add linting hints to builds to find them
* [x] Recommend how to package them -> CFEP-18
* [x] We should write docs saying we don't provide support and this is a bad idea. -> CFEP-18